The SFFaudio Podcast #846 – AUDIOBOOK/READALONG: Lilith by George MacDonald

The SFFaudio Podcast #846 – Lilith by George MacDonald (10 hours 5 minutes) read by Pete Williams for LibriVox – followed by a discussion. Participants in the discussion include Jesse, Scott Danielson, and Tom Pace.

Talked about on today’s show:
A Romance, 1895, analyses, Christian universalist, congregationalist minister, a fantasy character, fascinated, first wife of Adam, where did that come from, Jewish mythology, Kabalaha, the Talmud, acquainted, an intellectual blah blah, Answer To Job by Carl Jung, predates Joseph Campbell, 10 hours, first 10 chapters, last 10 chapters, final ending, Mr Crow, that healing cycle, hope, a level of forgiveness, this podcast, the process of becoming wiser, read some more books, some of them stick with you and make you wiser, a George MacDonald, one of the Ballantine Adult Fantasy, old books are good, Tolkien, Lewis, Phantastes, The Princess And The Goblin, A.A. Milne, in dialogue, Edgar Rice Burroughs version is a Princess Of Mars, Lieut. Gullivar Jones: His Vacation aka Gullivar Jones: His Vacation, Edwin Lester Arnold, portal fantasy, whimsy and fancy, for a comedy purpose, not a lot of humour in this book, a world that’s a parallel society, not a lot of running water, a little girl, our solo male adventurer, a transformative experience, David Lindsay’s A Voyage To Arcturus, Lin Carter, very good taste and a very avid interest, his Conan knock offs, the curator, books on books, a man with good taste, mediocre fiction writing, done a lot of good for a lot of people, since they came out, late-19th century and early 20th century, Charwoman’s Shadow, The King Of Elfland’s Daughter, The Broken Sword, twigged to, Scott Miller’s Lost Sci-Fi Podcast, The Door In The Wall by H.G. Wells, encounters a woman, a fantastic realm, 2 panthers, shows him a book, the boy having adventures, outside the door, three more times does the green door appear, an exam at school, a minister in the British government, the third time he goes through, something else going on here, a construction site, haunted that boy, made him the man he was, he sought death, what is the meaning of all that in the story, after reading this, green doors are magic doors, something that doesn’t come up any more, a portal fantasy, an explanation, relatively mundane, servants quarters, baize, felt like on a pool table, little children were taken under the wing of a servant, magical land, they love you, no longer allowed to pass through that green door, quasi-memory, is she Circe?, full of symbolism, Aslan is a lion, that’s fine, supposed to be Jesus, the raven in here, Mr. Raven, Mr. Crow, little ideas here and there, christian symbolism, dying to self, selflessness is what you need to do, Lilith with her clenched fists, the Ring in Lord Of The Rings, progression would be dying to self, allegory, roughly use the term, a deep analysis, Mr. Vane, Charles?, climbing the mountain in the city of God, literalist toward the divine, allegorical towards our lives, the end of The Last Battle, a new version of Narnia, ups and down, up is heaven down is hell, the mirror was in the attic?, in the library, if it was in the attic, the head, the brain, the cellar is the guts, water in this book, no running water, red running liquid, when he cries, are those rivers, you would never finish reading the book, it made me clean, a nice book, a very weak book compared to this, talking animal, A Night In Lonesome October by Roger Zelazny, characters presented, Dracula, you’re supposed to figure it out, this is just a big shaggy dog story, wanting to read it every October, 31 chapters, a cute book, no substantive weight, dense with meaning, events that happen in it are fine, full of ideas, propaganda for a certain point of view, we can all get salvation no matter what horror we’ve committed, everybody’s got a path to redemption and salvation, making it very clear in the book, Aslan’s a talking lion, he’s the king, all these children with no parents, we find them in the forest, not a random encounter in Dungeons & Dragons, 19th century orphans, be like little children, innocent and fearful, stunted in growth, they don’t mature, there’s these giants who are scary and dangerous, reading this with a cynical mind, that adult man should not be sleeping with a bunch of children who are not their own, our relationship to other humans in the pure light of god, true and clean and just, a striking set of scenes, experience in this book, finds the corpse of the woman, dried right to her bone, nurses her back to health, mysterious bites, getting sucked on, pretty sure she’s a vampire, it was big bad snake, I threw it in the river, an intimacy there, to give it warmth, warming it somewhat perhaps, makes clothes for her, heavily symbolic, why C.S. Lewis loves it so much, really good messaging, I can use this, shades of Narnia in it, not a book for children, stars children, the very real horror of WWII to a fantasy countryside, morally educative, accessible for children, a good C.S. Lewis quote, “put away”, Corinthians 1:13, critics who treat “adult” as a term of approval, to be concerned about being grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish, in moderation healthy symptoms, arrested development, fairy tales in secret, read them openly, the fear of childishness, very grown up, the people who stop reading science fiction regret it, I don’t want people to know I’m reading Harry Potter, when you have actually grown up, making a mistake, need to move on from this stuff, graduate to mimetic literary fiction about nothing, Ray Bradbury, he was told he needed to mature, returned to that, he got back into it very enthusiastically, one summer, summer school, playing LEGO, looking forward to playing LEGO, didn’t want to zoom it around the room, unable to be that imaginative, let’s make this airplane look good, play better, a graduation out of a certain stage, get into writing, become playful again, a cool car that somebody built, design the cool car, taps into the relationship with childhood, a long way of saying, The Screwtape Letters, Out Of The Silent Planet, very interesting, the Good Story Is Hard To Find podcast, Scott’s a Catholic, Bishop Robert Barron, play is something you do for its own sake, the highest form of doing something for its own sake, a purity to it, think of non-human baby animals, become playful, the wrestling, the chasing, becoming what they are, a puppy on Tuesday, naughty is something little kids can be, an older dog, she has a job, no sheep available, border collie, naturally wants to herd sheep, when not full of puppies and nursing puppies, watching all the chicks, go back to doing her job, if anything ever goes wrong, she doesn’t play very much, this instinctual job of being a mom or a worker, graduate out of it, getting back in touch with it, creative and fulfilment, a better explanation, divines play, something done for its own end, a means to another end, in our society, we have it backwards, impoverished, the highest form of human, Catholic Mass As Play, Jordan Peterson, seems to be helping a lot of boys a lot of men, free from utility and practicality, more beautiful, more precious than work, means are not the ends, the means are more valuable, the ends are more meaningful, what I mean to say, the ends, a need to valuate is a need to defeat the actual experience itself, to valuate love, Halloween, go trick-or-treating, random stranger’s home, demand candy, be polite when you demand your candy, a year where you stop going, not because you’re not allowed, you’ve graduated from that, make their costumes, something scary, keep part of that story going, mass as play, all holidays are play days, Christmas, pretend that santa gave you a Christmas present, you need to write a note for Santa claus, we don’t have a chimney, drinks the glass, there’s only crumbs on the plate, perpetuate that play, prefer malt liquor, on the back, a quote from C.S. Lewis, most myths were made in prehistoric times, MacDonald is the greatest genius of that kind, what Tolkien had to say, a vehicle of mystery, twitter tweet, the end of The Last Battle, the ending and the feel of the world, the end of The Silmarillion, a supreme fan of it, the six parts, the chunk of the whole story, an epilogue part 2, Of The Rings Of The Power In The Third Age, ten pages, a little by the way, the scale, 30,000 pages, it ends after the end of The Lord Of The Rings, Gimli and Legolas sail across the sea, the last elf that leaves Middle Earth, the Undying Lands, the rift from third age, bonded over killing orcs, sailing over water, the rounding of the Earth, the same ending, Milton, Paradise Lost, Paradise Regained, what’s that all about, cycle of death and rebirth, a positivity that just carries, Novalis, a German writer, many hats 1802, the introduction by Lin Carter, The Land Beyond The Hidden Door by Lin Carter, William Morris, The Wood Beyond The World, The Well At World’s End, the school of modern adult fantasy, Lord Dunsany, Fletcher Pratt, a retired Scots minister, At The Back Of The North Wind, chemistry and natural philosophy, enormously successful, Within And Without, Tennyson and Lady Byron, adult fantasy novels, celebrated, famous, popular, Ruskin, Tennyson, Lewis Carroll, uniformly happy and fruitful, surrounded by an adoring family, a mystical genius for fairy romance, a large genial ebulliently happy man, Roger Lancelyn Green, an actor, Pilgrim’s Progress, his strict Calvinist upbringing, heaped atop, writer friends, begging for his opinion, instant love, so good there should be 60,000 more volumes of it, serene and happy man, warm and rare companionship, a wonderful time, fishing to his heart’s content, dark mountain caves, wild kelpies, romantic mysticism, psychological truths, deep and strong, woven into their textures, Scots blood, an inner faith, a rich multilayered style, a depth, a wisdom, and a strength, his two adult fantasies, a fairy romance, 1858, Bunyon for example, difficult to read, ten years before his death, seizes your attention, profound and moving, bright mocking faces, thrilling imaginative force, use of dream symbols is amazing, as you begin it, prodigious imaginative power, a secret door, the setting is worthy of Poe at his highest intensity, shadows of the past, ancient labyrinthine library, stifling silence, passing through he enters upon a mysterious world, a very unusual and stimulating book, Surprised By Joy, Wagner, William Morris, for The Lion The Witch And The Wardrobe, much in MacDonald, W.H. Auden, Professor Tolkien, The Hobbit or The Lord Of The Rings, Curdie, behind Tolkien’s orcs, goblins, in an afterword, absolutely fatal, kills the magic, lose yourself in it, The Golden Key, the old man of the earth, you must throw yourself in, Poe, Jesse’s very supportable and correct theory about The Raven by Poe, the difference between Poe and MacDonald, Poe is not a Christian, conversations between angels, demons, Jesus is one million percent absent, an American 19th century, map on more stuff, make a whole lot of mistakes, the name of the faun, Tumnus, a pagan symbol, don’t read too much into it, even though he has devil legs, most Christian fiction is horrible, completely transparent, his worldview oozes out of it, he’s said such things, drawing on all these sources, what would happen next, based in his worldview, that’s the good stuff, revisions, like 8, a chunky book, super Dante, with every revision the Dante retreated, very dark, kind of a science fiction story but really not, also about suicide, the heart of this book, a lot about death, is he Adam as well?, multiple identities, he is also death, this whole land is death, a mode of being, works really well, pretty good book, a fairy romance for men and women, only 6 and half hours with a single narration, that essay was good, haven’t read much Conan, his contributions, you don’t even need to read Conan, read any Robert E. Howard will do the job, when he’s not a teenager, a real power and poetry, not lead as fulfilling a life as you could have, Fritz Leiber’s Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser, they’re buddy buddy, in his poems too, to read fiction, gave it away, The Screwtape Letters, The King Of Elfland’s Daughter, The Charwoman’s Shadow, Lord Dunsany, short little tiny 1 page stories, chunky novels, normal size, the ideal novel size, 250 pages, epics are good too, a bin of books, 99 pages, James M. Cain, Mildred Pierce, the actual narrator, narrator Pete Williams, his mic was not good in the first few chapters, Levelator, intros and outros, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, a straight reader, he’s a hero, he made this for free, because he wanted to do it, we get the benefit from it, he did another one, Hymns To The Night by Novalis translated by George MacDonald, narrator Jonathan St. John, he was excellent, a commercial release through audible, OneAudiobooks, interpretive illustration, Gabrielle Ragusi, a cover, some sketches beneath, her armour, Vane, this mirror, so audio oriented, 10 illustrations, make a nice gift for somebody, as a central character in the book, she’s the object of the book, she’s the subject being discussed, dragged kicking and screaming to her salvation, what’s our narrator doing there?, legit asking, he’s not her lover, The Odyssey, fills a trench with blood, ghosts come and they drink the blood, one of the ghosts is his dad, Upon The Dull Earth by Philip K. Dick, hell or hades, things go wrong, going into the underworld to get your girlfriend, a young man’s realization of spiritual enlightenment, ambiguous enough, he’s got more to do in life, stops going into the library, the world of childish things, that mirror is hidden from him until he comes back from school, what the mirror looks like, make Grok illustrated, a black eagle, a gold chain, a black ball, another black bird, the raven, the crow, not make distinctions, not just size but proportion, an eagle and a crow, behavior, the chain is gold, is that a weight you put on prisoners, a golden chain, not a black chain, not an iron chain, very interesting, Jesse’s excellent theory, textually evident, the beautiful sounds, a vulture, more obviously death symbol, how can you not recognize an animal for what it is, the same species, not an expert on birds, especially a bird up on top of a mirror, a guy named Mr. Raven, our hero follows him into it, a moorland, a place of emptiness, a series of, adventures, a series of dream images, participating in events, he doesn’t know his own name, when did that happen, in a dream, morph from one into another, making a mistake, let the story do its job, other people do do that symbolic work, it’s all just what it is, this beautiful other level, the beautiful writing, the line about the library, FYI, back to the mirror, makes more sense, I never again sought the mirror, profoundly changed by things, where is that place, where is the land through the mirror?, a secondary world, a connection to modern earth, it’s not hell either, some sort of purgatory, a symbolic place, ineffable stuff, strange dim memories which will not abide identification, I never dream now, when most awake only dreaming the more, Walking by Henry David Thoreau, a Novalis quote, our life is no dream but it should and will perhaps become one, a line about the library and his relationship to it, born into a library it will outlive you, studies at Oxford, why would he be doing that?, within a year, profound effect, desultory fashion, the physical science, shame shame, constantly seeing, strange analogies, physical hypotheses, about to fall into a metaphysical dream, spelling it all out, mental peculiarities, the house as well of the family is of some antiquity, a fine library, before the invention of printing, nothing surely can more impress upon a man than his succeeding to an property slowly flitting before my own, he shown into the room, who is he?, the feathering top of a fountain column, a portrait in a sort of niche, the likeness of one of my ancestors, for the first time I seemed to see it, made me turn and cast a glance to the farther end of the room, my optic nerves had been momentarily affected from within, just there I had seen, the old man in search of a book, just where I had thought to find it, very close to the opening of The Raven, in December, forgotten lore, wrought its ghost upon the floor, he’s in a library, a stack of books, enjoying the light, girlfriend or wife has died, she’s come back to life, a Guy de Maupassant story, a missing finger, a person alone in a library trying to find peace by reading, out of the library and into another world, the house is on fire, still is sitting, on the pallid bust of Pallas, shall be lifted nevermore, if he’s not dying at least he’s in hell, something different with the same situation, smart people can come up with the same ideas independently, Scott’s end, Sante Fe, New Mexico, excellent, Project Pope, the schedule, one of Jesse’ hobbies, Clifford D. Simak, a robot pope, Simak is great, the collected works of Carl Jung, a good way to conclude, chip in to that vibe, audiobook, readalong, a few bugs in the reading, some really excellent quotes from the early chapters, the poetic style, when Raven is telling Vane about the prayer flower, the silent voices of characters, comes out as a dove and it ascends, Jung’s Red Book, the Holy Spirit, an anemone, that is a prayer flower, not one prayer flower is quite like another, by the expression of it, could you teach me to know a prayer flower when I see it?, why know the name of the thing when the thing itself you do not know, beautiful poetry, discomfort vanished, a pronunciation error?, a proof listener for LibriVox, if you did deep into the LibriVox forms, make this project happen, some of the meanings, we sat down to the perfect meal, the bread and wine seemed to go deeper than the hunger and thirst, expectation took their place, comfort vanished, discomfort, all would be well, what will be well is even well now, rings so well, a good book, maybe some stuff aimed at kids, the adult fantasy series, At The Back Of The North Wind, Scott does a lot of church volunteering, what they need to do, The Magic City by Edith Nesbit, Jason Thompson, a really terrific artist, Shonen Jump, manga, comic book adaptation of H.P. Lovecraft stories, The Dream-Quest Of Unknown Kadath, Stephen Colbert had a TV show, a shot of the writer’s room, a poster of The Dreamlands, the book and the poster, find some rando on the internet, make a friend, we should do a show on that one, serialized in The Strand, a giant model city, alive with the people he has populated it with, The Lego Movie (2014), Synecdoche New York (2008), a robot bishop talking to a robot monk pruning a bush, 1981, search the universe, a robotic supercomputer, I’ll read any old Simak, we’ll get an audiobook, always associated, the audio part of the SFF, Prize Ship and The Ship Who Sang, very short stories, recorded both, Eaters Of The Dead by Michael Crichton, The Thirteenth Warrior (1999), redid the whole score, the story is fun, in the paperback he plays games, The Andromeda Strain, the copyright page and the front matter, meta-stuff, a combo on two short stories, The Jamieson Satellite by Neil R. Jones and Melonta Tauta by Edgar Allan Poe, memorizing and writing poems out longhand, creative bent, everything, from Jordan Peterson’s sources, writing therapy and reading of classics, booklist, Dostevesky, clinicians, what he said about Jung, doing your shadow work?, who is in your shadow, why do I hate that guy so much, Michio Kaku, all the people he talks to, pushed back and asked questions, he got so mad, basic lies, accept it and nod their heads, a supercut, not a one off mistake, 100 years ago long distance communication was yelling out the window, telephone, medicine has improved so much, in what ways, look I’m smart, a theoretical physicist, same thing with quotes, Canadian Quotations, where did this quote actually appear in this person’s work, Robert A. Heinlein, Heinlein doesn’t use this word, kinda similar to what Heinlein had one character say, that sort of stuff is in my shadow, all presidents kill people, not everything is equal to everything else, show your work, trying to understand string-theory, where was the tests that you did for this, all theoretical, that guy’s never flying that car, the rotax engines never got the thing off the ground, getting lied to, Jesse doesn’t want to be that guy, the objective of shadow work, psychotheraputic, root influences, his career, psychiatry, medical psychology, academic psychology, theorizing and la-de-dah vs. medical psychiatry, make a person better, psychiatry, intending to make you aware of the problems, make a person not so reactive, not so volatile and reactive, qualities that are annoying to other people, socially well rounded, allowed to be annoying, obnoxiously demand, disagree on Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, 70 hours for 1 volume, there are multiple Jordan Petersons, personas, his utube, subtopics, he behaves differently, private videos, personally talking to him, he know how to perform, a character quality of his presentation, he’s a presenter, rooted in his being a professor, you could call him out on those things, dignity and courtesy, an actual dialogue, when Joe Rogan has him on Yon Mi Park, too much plastic surgery and had some traumatic experience, the Korean refugees are all from South Korea, my kid can’t handle, the government isn’t controlled by the United States as much, politics, propaganda, Russia has definitely had its problems, one of the poorest European countries into one of the richest, same thing happened in China, the Russian revolution, a really interesting fact, after [WWI], have to support the White Russians, a forgotten piece of history, how did this hate-on for Russians come from?, a pea in the same pod as Jung and Peterson, not a marketer, getting lots of money, a very useful archetype, knowing that you have something that you don’t know, until you are triggered by the thing that triggered you, ceased to be psychological, three branches of the study of the mind, psychology, sociology, collective unconscious, canceled all television subscriptions, not a huge fan of Karl Marx, pro-Peterson people, things that he should hate him for, the shadow of the Marxian/post-modern thing, vilifies it all, alter strong criticism against Marx, what the final outcome is, people don’t approach Marx, bring Marx up, even interesting, the unabridged Gulag Archipelago, 2100 pages, endless, on archive.org, you wouldn’t read that, a giant report on the prison system in the Soviet Union should not be a popular work, who could?, volume 1 of the 3 volumes, what’s going on in the 2nd volume, the Ottawa protest from 2022, the truckers, if you were there, a whole world of unbelievable experience, truckers are heroes, not written as a report, more written for the human to read as a story, an experiment in literary investigation, a venting friendly strange story, not friendly, soul searching, Solzhenitsyn was an avowed Marxian, the biggest Marxian ever, Will Emmons, self-declare communist, read a lot more Mao, a Leninist Marxist, when you approach somebody as an individual, Hitler or Pol Pot, present yourself in an interface, I’m not a weakling but I’m not going to beat you up, enemy hormones, you’re my brother, it happens so fast, presenting something that’s attractive or repulsive, allyship, amity, character traits, the story of the photographer, meets Goebbels, demon eyes looking at the camera, all roses, weird experiments, all in the show, all your interesting secret history, almost nobody listening, it’s for posterity, strange experience with some random person, what do you think of contraception, not a hypothetical, a practical tool, something you think is very important, not a good question for twitter, not good at subtlety, an interesting bookshelf that people don’t like, I have Mein Kampf, that book is not banned, Mussolini and the fascists in Italy, what do you think of Hitler, a long show, not a simple story, if we’re ever going to talk about Hitler, hired to be a spy, like Ray Epps, trick people into becoming criminals, very successful at it, why Hitler’s evil, the system that he was the head of, who you going to point your fingers at, we fucked up by joining WWI, Germany wanted to be an Empire, a snowstorm, a rolling down a hill, Hitler wanted to be allies with Britain and the United States, deputy prime minister Chrysta Freeland’s grandpa was a nazi, did a documentary on plutocracy, if you’re going to have the conversation, allow the breathing space wherever the path goes, awareness and new knowledge, touches a lot on WWII, part of the Red Army, his criticism of Stalin, how Churchill is just as culpable, treatment of the Cossacks, the cute guy who liked machine guns and won WWII, the story of the Cossacks, GoldenEye (1995), Sean Bean’s backstory, the whole history of them, a subculture of mercenary mentalities, enforcers for the Czars, horseguys hired by the Czars to do a purge, the guys who attacked the Roman Empire, ancestors have done evil, happens all the time, empires do this all day long, friendly conversation, new awareness, counterpart to writing therapy, reading therapy where you read fiction, one book leads to another, a bunch of pirate books, Marcus Rediker, books, economics, not exactly communism, anybody can defect, don’t bring women on the ship, light the place on fire, The Fearless Benjamin Lay, participating the slave trade, book leads on to book, a Simak novel, value to be drawn from it, mimetic fiction, realistic fiction, horrible stuff like The Life Of Pi, just mimetic fiction with fantasy dressing, a mainstream novel, a lady that acts like a robot but she’s not a robot, just make her a robot, it gets past your defenses, only care about the ideas, the best path for reading, conversations that we’ve had previous, kind of weird, not pleasurable to read, how long is it, get it done in a week, a whole bunch on YouTube, underneath of Peterson is Jung, Maps Of Meaning, videos, the core of his work, the force to be reckoned with, what he’s approaching, from another perspective, standing on the shoulders of many giants, three tributaries, Jung’s Alchemy, a self therapy thing, the source of spirituality and the world religions, a giant basis, a singular pool or lake, nice metaphor, 30 hours, super hard to read, dense, extra hard and three times as long, don’t read it for this podcast, The Edge Of Thought Ideas, needs social almost every day, cognition, might help, 1652, Elias Ashmole, The Ordinal Of Alchemy, allegory that points to the real world, so abstract, as if the real world was abstract, the root of the I Ching, arabic, chimera, Frankenstein by Mary Shelley, what everybody says about it, people queue up on what other people are saying, a comedy piece, am I wrong, is this not supposed to be hilarious, a really dry sense of humour, cut up dead bodies, uses electricity, gets materials, creates the creature, Galvani and other such, the growing man in a jar, material reaction happens, growing crystals, sugar water, heat and time, on the end of a string, sugar crystals, the mandrake, grow a man in a jar, grew a man in a jar or an alchemical process, bones around which to grown, stitches, a black man’s arm, nothing like that, oversize, translucent skin, the ugliness could be beauty, improper proportions, Marilyn Monroe without the beauty mark, the beauty mark moves around, she has the beauty mark, the little imperfection that shows her what the image is, a giant newborn baby, the psychological reading of it, the 1818 version, no stitching, ourside the family’s home, the creature destroying Frankenstein’s remaining family, fuck off?!, fuck you!!, his bride, his cousin, his father in the Creature’s shadow, more like an exam, the best it can be, regret, six or seven months after, spurs more research and such, Strange Case Of Dr Jekyll And Mr Hyde, it was supposed to be a reveal, spoilers, we know going in now, that’s what this is supposed to be, he rewrote it, a complete rewrite of the same book, earbuds, bluetooth, stuff about the writing of that book, him vs. his writing, Treasure Island, a nice guy to know, four copies of The Aeneid, the collected worlds of Carl Jung, Anna Karenina, Riverside Milton, Wagner, Voltaire, re read Candide, funny books, Der Ring des Nibelungen, Douglas Adams, a full cast production, you get one bad actor, just learning English, so distracted, reading styles, not worth the trouble, Tannhauser, Venusburg, seek absolution from the pope, only 2 hours, Nibelungenlied, epic poem, 1000 years ago, Canterbury Tales, 20 hours, the more time it takes to prep, fewer people show up, we lost three of those people, Christmas season, been fun, Geoffrey Chaucer, sharing stories, The Canon’s Yeoman’s Tale, the prologue, scammery, very enjoyable, The Alchemist by H.P. Lovecraft, episode 567, kinda similar, the best story ever, still great, the head of a dragon, no mirrors in this castle, family is warning him not to go to town, hooked on that idea, everybody seeing him in his innocence, a metaphorical ugly duckling story, a goose, a shadow of all the people who are looking at him, it lends itself to reading that way, I’m alive!, he puts on clothes, the lab coat, wanders off into the wilderness, cold and hungry, nuts and veggies, his creator was afraid of him, he comes to a house, he spies on the people through a crack in the wall, an old man who’s blind, gather wood for the fire, a little interaction, learns to read, a really fun nested narrative, Evan Lampe, Hay Ibn Yaqzan by Ibn Tufail, a guy born out of a muddle puddle, he’s a baby, a female deer becomes his mother, the mother dies, I don’t know what death is, a history of philosophy and science told through the narrative of person, science and philosophy, raised by deer, the Tarzan books, read an old book and you learn a lot, silly alchemy words, in and out narrative, written in the 1400s, Hyperion by Dan Simmons, meet the shrike, books that rhyme with other books.

Lilith by George MacDonald

Lilith by George MacDonald - cover by Gabrielle Ragusi

Posted by Jesse Willis

The SFFaudio Podcast #732 – READALONG: Black Priestess Of Varda by Erik Fennel

Jesse, Paul Weimer, Alex (pulpcovers) and Cora Buhlert talk about Black Priestess Of Varda by Erik Fennel

Talked about on today’s show:
Audiobooksnow.com, 500 other websites after Audible and Downpour that sell audiobooks, this books exists only out in the world outside of Audible and Downpour, Brian K. Fitzgibbon, the story itself is , foliage, otherwise a good narration, the ultimate book, a hard intro, all of the negative stereotypes of pulp science fiction, Planet Stories, not the literary science fiction, the luridist, fairly strong, this is fun, this is good, it fell apart, the middle doesn’t make a lot of sense, the ending is good, extending psychedelic floating, pregnant at the end, twins, this woman raped him while he was in the bacta tank, when Luke is in the bacta tank, Mark Hamill had had a car accident, injuries explained away, hand chopped off twice, disabled protagonist, crippled is offensive, a pain in your phantom arm, Gil Hamilton, a crippled protagonist, disabled war veterans, missing a hand, a scarred face, a blind eye, a missing eye, a plus for the story, three strong female characters (two of them are the same), he’d been betrayed by his fiance, clearly a villain from the beginning, a good setup for a story, mid-20th century telepathy, not a good exploration of the topic, monkey squirrel lemur thing, also telepathic, something out of 1980s kid’s cartoon, would make a great cartoon, should be adapted as a cartoon, a pretty cracking story, gets his abilities, it would be better if he didn’t have abilities, I’m the best telepathy, immune to telepathy, who’s on the cover, a scene from the story, Allen Anderson reusing the same image, lady with a sword over her head, also a Leigh Brackett cover, Black Amazon Of Mars, an axe, grey lumpy things, he’s not disabled, he has two arms (one is hidden), it is Crasna, but she’s a redhead, the interior art, the vat scene, the lavender liquid, his girlfriend Margaret getting all stabby, cutting off all of his thumb, lost in the mist, missing an arm, very accurate, page 25 art, totally missing an arm there, a scratch across his face, with a savage bellow, the pasty gray features, sluggishly back, prostrate form, soundlessly, a blue black fluid gushed from the wound, Erik Fennel is not a famous person, as Planet Stories pulpy as Jesse has read, a Gardner F. Fox, returning to Mars, returning to Barsoom, a portal fantasy, very Edgar Rice Burroughs, he’s an inventor, The Door Into Summer by Robert A. Heinlein, time travel, freezes himself, she’s much older, she’s fat, she’s been drained of sasso, very Lovecraft, Dwellers In The Mirage by A. Merritt, vikings at the north pole, squid god eating virgins, pregnant ladies are delicious, his source for the material, monolimbed, monohanded, blood gushin out of him, repainted by Anderson, Sargasso Of Lost Starships, Bettie Page haircut, yellow foil-age, a little blue city, under the text, what do you think, people talking about sensitivity readers (both pro and con), a panel of sensitivity readers, some subject they’re not an expert in, Chinese and something else (maybe Vietnamese), an expert on Japan, makes sense, a double amputee, bloody offensive, bipolar is not the same thing as an amputee, probably pretty different, gay and a minority skin colour, the writer, an expert witness, a thinking chain that’s not encumbent with the title “sensitivity reader”, immensively important to the book, not collaboration, later Elmore Leonard novels, his 90s stuff, getting up there, he had a professional researcher, professional diving, interesting facts, wow that’s amazing, it really sucked, the dialogue was the same, you could see the hands of the researcher’s work, the particular setting, civil war reenactors, “farbs”, modern underwear underneath, bringing a zippo lighter to the battlefield, hanging out with those guys as a first person person vs. having your researcher do it for you a year before you, that’s the difference, a real sense of place, a real sense of dialogue, he knows the places and he knows the cultures, this is actually why sensitivity readers are working, writing about stuff they don’t know anything about, a researcher magic wand, like Wikipedia, an inkling about something about something, Erik Fennel was disabled, an engineer, an inventor, Fall 1947, Beneath The Red World’s Crust, a dude with a blaster and a dagger on his hip, holding a blonde, blue aliens, a rocketship, a vampire bat, P.S. Feature Flash, Atavism, during a childhood spent barefoot in Hawaii, prehensile toes, Eve and Lilith, the dog insists, a propeller, 2:47 am, a model-T sparkplug, molten lead and cold water, just short of atomic, studying co-eds, Heath Parasol, a kitbuilt aircraft, a truck driver, bootlegger’s assistant, riding the rods, amateur boxer/goat wrangler, structural steel work, born without a fear of heights, one day there was a very nasty mess, a retread job in my skull, 4F, arrested development, Science And Invention, Hugo Gernsback, a housetrailer, a portable basement, used oil wells, deep auto-hypnotic research, the editor of Galaxy [Planet Stories], Nichevo, Russian for what can you do?, that’s how it is!, makes you like the story more, makes you like the art more, the art informs the story, the art of the writing, texts should stand on their own (but also they don’t), everything is connected to other things, give a kid Shakespeare, another essay from 1950, utopianism, Nobody Wants Utopia, Science Fantasy Review, Winter 1949-1950, the slave system they have, zombies, they treat them, they give them the pill, a culture that has declined, the superiors had roads, there were always two races, more primitive people, benevolent, H.P. Lovecraft with Zealia Bishop, The Mound, an underworld utopia, the closed world, creating a setting, the author insert returns to it at the end, I’m going home, she’s having my babies, genocide these poor people, kill orcs because they are elves turned by Sauron thinking, utopia, dry and hot summers, cold winters, he’s given himself a fantasy world, he chooses to go back into the fantasy, helpful to understanding the story, it’s a real lump, The Goddess Of Atvatabar, mental powers, they create an island, that happens in this too, a Leigh Brackett, The Moon That Vanished, mental powers, lost in their fantasy world, suicidal drug addict, picturing his girlfriend, he grabs the other woman, quite a common theme, also Inception (2010), WWII, trailer, not super-negative, creation of a world inside of a story, roads and a car, he’s an engineers, mid-20th century engineers knew everything, that fantastic power is the power to be a writer for Planet Stories, a product of it being a longer piece for a magazine that cranks out a lot of pulp, not a classic, snap up the IP, the She-Ra: Princess Of Power cartoon, a planet besieged by aliens, drains of energy, rebels lead by a brave woman, twins, Hordak, not impossible, why you can’t read anything out of context, all the Shakespeare plays are historical pieces, the pulp, Star Wars, Buck Rogers, Flash Gordon, inform, time spent looking for the literary roots of Indiana Jones, drawn from the vibes, a smell, an aesthetic, the suspension bridge, cliffhanger, quite literally, movie serials, magazine serials, wait 30 years, not inspired by the original sources, the new Andor series, notably good, a guy on a planet trying to find his sister, mall cops, corporate security, too much content, there’s way too much stuff, its very hard to know if anything is good, everything is lying to you all the time, they’re all being gamed, people mention things in twitter threads, increasingly required to ask, I can’t watch all of that, not all of them have the same taste, big long reviews, consumer reviews, you have to dig, drowned out, ignored, the latest thing, a culture war fight, American Gigolo, The Punisher, how can I know if it is good?, it’s exactly what you’re interested in, lot’s of airships, bread and butter cop dramas, cartoon dinosaur show, periphery, The Rogues In The House podcast, this is great, our serious problem, an experiment today, too deep into the story, not the ideal story to start their pulp fiction experience, Robert E. Howard, some Leigh Bracketts, C.L. Moores, higher quality pulp, this isn’t that bad, Werewile Of The Crystal Crypt by Gardner F. Fox, they all look down at Planet Stories, bad stories in Astounding Science Fiction, mid to low level Planet Stories, mediocre Weird Tales is entertaining, The Ghost Table, fun adventure, fast paced, what we got, a slower pace in the middle, lots of action, what if the speed of light changed by 3 percent?, what bad Astounding often looked like, bound charges, almost skipable, if your assignment was to fix this story, spend a lot less time recovering, three months later, drama, go with the interesting opening, lay around a little less, more time with the badguys, she’s a bad girl but a lot of fun, more from Victor’s point of view, Margaret’s catspaw, boy toy, Sin and Wor, very subtle, on the nose, Axis and Allies, written in reverse, Matson, Sasso, a fad dance from the 1950s, The Wizard Of Wor, Wor’s military tunic, Faith, Elvedon, a pocket universe, The Elf-Trap by Francis Stevens, a tradition he’s slipping into, Stanley G. Weinbaum, there’s no rocket ship, it is a portal fantasy, transports him to a world, closed worlds, thin world, like Cthulhu worshipers, A Night In Lonesome October by Roger Zelazny, the lavender liquid, that sloshing, some kind of acid, absorbs their energy, a convoluted system, as a priestess, all the best cults are sex cults, Superiors, the gross gray bodies, they utterly refused to remain dead, lacking sufficient converts, Faith, Superiors, the hunted folk, thought was a tangible force, a stand in for the author, more things cut off, will the wall to light, a wish-fulfillment fantasy world, maybe we have to genocide these monsters, the little lemur guy, weak, but not that bad, the connection, Stephen R. Donaldson’s Thomas Covenant books, what’s the scene that Paul and Cora don’t like, leprosy, white gold wedding ring, his rape daughter shows up, not real, absolutely annoying, he’s also a whiner, extremely unlikable, he doesn’t think any of it is real, half excuses the whole thing, The Gap Into Conflict, space opera, blink drives, The Real Story, an asteroid miner, roll a d100, turn people into remote control zombies, policewoman, he’s not supposed to be the hero, very gritty, well told, incorporating other people’s researches, what they’re thinking about, writing is thinking, he’s not a raw power, perfectly serviceable, problems selling, Chinese Filipino, Hawaii, that experience is his experience, a story that hasn’t sold yet, he blames that on gatekeepers of editors, half-naked, Valeria, Dark Agnes, Jirel of Joiry, Farnsworth Wright, he never got really old, oh, it’s a Howard story!, non-white protagonist, The Ship Who Sang by Anne McCaffrey, thalidomide, magically healed, he lies around a lot, to hide his superpower, his mind is broken, the cover does not participate in LegCling, whips, a chain whip, BrassBra hashtag, just assumed, clinging gowns, a lot of nudity, a lot of sex, disabled sex, sex orgy cult, remarkably horny, more explicit, is it less horny when it is explicit?, a shudder pulp story, the ultimate shudder pulp, the covers and the titles, the story premises, Lovecraft plus sex and humiliation and racism, Dime Mystery, not easy to find, they didn’t sell well, pricey, The Spider, the lurid stuff, Terror Tales, E. Hoffman Price, there must be something in there, the pinnacle of the shudder pulp, still fun, unique, a little lemur thing and whips, lavender acid, revealing something, Genndy Tartakovsky, a Planet Stories animated series, you’re doing Heavy Metal, technothriller science fictiony compared to this, The Rocketeer (1981), why aren’t we having more like The Rocketeer, Batman (1989), The Shadow (1994), The Phantom, Dick Tracy, Nudist Camp by Orrie Hitt, 4 hours, read by Evan Lampe, the back cover, they worshiped nature in the raw, scathing novel, where she came from, swim or subathe unclad, so lovely, so innocent, began to love nature a little too passionately, a she-devil had entered paradise, her own glorious body, having sex with a tree, a tree fucking contest, Germans love their nudity, naturalists, nature worship, airbathing, skyclad, a nudist beach, of course I looked, Wreck Beach, the communist had no clothes they were so poor!, they saved them for the winter, they weren’t wearing a wire, Evan Lampe: “it’s a good book”, Evan’s female voice, not a Paul book, Brother And Sister by Donald E. Westlake, The Black Stranger by Robert E. Howard, Roger Zelazny, Blaze, Cosmic Computer/Junkyard Planet, Innocents Abroad, Grave Descend, sell Easy Go to Alex, in Egypt, the last tomb, scam archaeologists, a heist story, a really great sense of place, written by someone who’s been there, Greece, Amsterdam, nice and short, Topkapi (1964), Korean War vet captains, journalist/writer, especially him, a very solid very readable book, very impressed by early Michael Crichton, he’s no Erik Fennel, write to the market, slim volumes, 160 page books vs. 700 page books, mainstream thrillers, measured by inches or by weight, Heads Of Cerberus by Francis Stevens, Vietnam, communing with the communists, a communist wedding, a half communist wedding, salvage, communist babies, The Thrill Book, after inhaling a grey dust, totalitarian Philadelphia, perhaps the first science fantasy to use parallel time track, dated and old fashioned, parallel worlds, one of the classics of early pulp, cynical anti-authoritarian, a fine anticipation of Philip K. Dick, stand in for the expertise, Fran Wilde and Chuck Wendig, definitely not a communist book reading, cool name, the cheese, a big city, skyscrapers exploding, school atlas, natural resource cards, coal and steel, pre-internet, Benjamin Franklin was president (of Pennsylvania), not a fake job, the supreme executive council, Rocky Balboa, a good writer, violent American trash, Rocky (1976), Rambo and Conan, a very good movie, he’s got heart, Carl Weathers, Dolph Lundgren, the cartoon aspect of it, this super-genius, Red Scorpion (1988), Masters Of The Universe (1987), not The Punisher (1989), Rocky IV (1985) was his best movie, Universal Soldier (1992), The Expendables movies, airplanes, Jet Li, riffs on their Hollywood personalities, speaking six languages, they’re making fun of the fact, tall and apparently smart and handsome he did very badly, Bloodsport (1988), not really a great actor, Schwarzenegger is charismatic on screen, they didn’t have the budget, Soviet Rambo, an American production, the first half of Red Dawn (1984), The Death Of Stalin (2017), American Ninja (1985), The Delta Force (1986), Iron Eagle (1986), she doesn’t understand what a podcast is, needs to grok, you don’t have to do the show nude.

Black Priestess Of Varda by Erik Fennel - cover art by ALLEN ANDERSON

Black Priestess Of Varda by Erik Fennel - ILLUSTRATION

Black Priestess Of Varda by Erik Fennel

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Reading, Short And Deep #338 – The Green Door by A.A. Milne

Podcast

Reading, Short And DeepReading, Short And Deep #338

Eric S. Rabkin and Jesse Willis discuss The Green Door by A.A. Milne

Here’s a link to a PDF of the story.

The Green Door was first published in Ladies’ Home Journal, December 1925.

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The SFFaudio Podcast #648 – AUDIOBOOK/READALONG: The Mad King by Edgar Rice Burroughs

Podcast

The SFFaudio PodcastThe SFFaudio Podcast #648 – The Mad King by Edgar Rice Burroughs; read by Delmar H. Dolbier. This is an unabridged reading of the novel (9 hours 16 minutes) followed by a discussion of it. Participants in the discussion include Jesse, Paul Weimer, Evan Lampe, Maissa Bessada, and Alex.

Talked about on today’s show:
a serial in All-Story, 1914 and 1915, reasons for confusion, the first half of this book is The Mad King, the second half is Barney Of Beatrice, follow ups, The Eternal Lover, some Tarzan action, Barney’s sister, the reincarnation of a cave man, who is this person, a spark, literary universe, paired the spares, paired with an unfrozen caveman, least favourite ERB, comparisons to The Prisoner Of Zenda, A Princess Of Mars, The Mucker, Robert E. Howard’s The Black Stone, H.P. Lovecraft, a stupid bet, honor, Barney has principles, Paul!, a no shaving contest, a true hero, never compromise, keeping in bearded and mustached, part of the genre, it tells you everything about Burroughs and Barney Custer, by reputation, The Prince And The Pauper by Mark Twain, whoa its Tarzan, before him stretched, the adjoining roof, clambering to the heights, he’s just swinging, Barney Custer invented parkour, the way the doubling was handled, the dependence on random chance, easily fixed with five minutes of work, his father was a soldier of fortune, a little background, car crashes, his car lands on the king, a eugenicist, princess genes, Colonel Custer, Custer was loser, fought against unbeatable odds, the rep he had, character flaws built right in, Barney is more prudent, The Efficiency Expert, the Austrian firing squad, the Serbian resistance, random luck, language, the shopkeeper spoke really good German, a German state, why this book isn’t as great as it should be, Rupert Of Hentzau, a guy going to an Eastern European country from England, a Germanic state, past Austria, he goes home, every year after, a rose kissed by his princess girlfriend, the best bad guy from the first book, a rogue, he’ll happily betray you and laugh about it, the first half of this book is the complete novel of Anthony Hope’s ZENDA and the second half maps to the second book RUPERT OF HENTZAU, the honorable thing to do, a scandal, one of his ancestors stole away a princess, cousins of the princess, the flaw in the first book is the sequel, going back and fixing the kingdom again, he leaves Lutha, that’s why this book is not as good as it should be, pathetic corrupt Europeans going to war, vs. the Americans know what to do, handwaved in the first, this king is bad from the start, a weak coward, a two-hander, the timing, March 21, 1914, serialized over three issues in 1915, WWI, Serbia, an analogy for World War I, the Black Hand, retconned, the location of Lutha comes in the second half of this book, 1-12 and 1-13, sneaks into a war torn country, the first half is set in at least 1913 the second half is set in August 1914, Anthony Hope’s novel is a fantasy, a portal fantasy, the Emperor of Austria/Hungary, not fully unified, two books in one book, from a fantasy into a John Buchan story (like The Thirty Nine Steps), the meld is ok, The Princess Diaries by Meg Cabot, Genovia, the novel is dated after a couple of years, Bulgaria, right at the heart of WWI, Casablanca (1942), Lichtenstein, Andorra, European principalities, the White Raja Of Sarawak, Einstein was offered the presidency of Israel, adopting foreigners as their kings, pistols, horses, and an automobile and an airplane, and artillery, does Zenda have two F-16s? does Lutha have Migs?, “He Conquered A Dyak Army And Turned All Borneo Into His Private Kingdom”, Pacific castaways, little kings, Omoo by Herman Melville, Typee, The Man Who Would Be King, trophy dwarves and trophy whites, Amazing!, a second son of a British lord, family bastards, kinda legit, so many layers of mirrors, falling asleep in a field, at the very core, its a guy who comes from the peerage vs. son of a farmer, a princesses husband, everybody is on the same level (theoretically), how beautiful the women were, his car and his guns, a princess equivalent of his mom, he reverses the story, he’s ruling as Barney, a legit claim, ultimately he’s a king, blood, right, [marriage], decorum, deed, spanking the Austrian army, we know, his princess is his legitimation, fun and interesting, a funny situation, an American repudiating a system of equality, the King’s Word Is Law, pretty horrible, Burroughs isn’t focused on that, American virtues, pluck and attitude, the fantasy coming an reasserting, always acting honorably, avoids lying, the king wills this, the blood of the royals runs through my veins, the way Burroughs wrote this, I’m not sure which guy is doing what, Barney being merciful (by not killing him) is actually cowardice, the play of which guy are we actually looking at, they look identical but the King is a little pudgier, they look identical in the second book, they look similar in the first book, except when he smile sneers, Dave (1993), the princess is Sigourney Weaver, he runs an employment agency, Jesse’s not an American, American gyms, Americans practiced circumcision, are Evan and Alex and Paul circumcised?, William Kellogg, less common, lets talk about your penis some more, a Germanic king of eastern Europe, The Return Of Martin Guerre, my foreskin got shot off, mapping moles on the kings back, Natalie Zemon Davis, Human Is by Philip K. Dick, also a Deep Space Nine episode (the Pah-wraiths), Keiko comes back bad, we need the bad angels, a person looking exactly like another person, first cousins, little bit legit, the book can still work as a whole novel, the weld is not perfect, why the book isn’t as good as it should be, Robin Hood in the mountains, instantly bandits, war leader, sneaking into the country, belt full of guns, for reasons, so many sneaking ins, the spy that looks like the girl’s boyfriend, Stephan, a double, she sold him out, he’s cuddling her, frees the prisoners, randomly survived being shot, the Serbian spy, a ragtag militia, the writers’ room on this one was out to lunch, I’m just going to die, funny comedy, they’re gaslighting each other but they don’t want to be, you’re mad, our hero Barney, stealing a car, scenes that don’t go anywhere, the first half is one issue, the second half is three issues (so all cliffhangers), the coincidences are artificial, iron things out, funny and cute vs. Lord Of The Rings, chess pieces moving around, from Sword And Sorcery to High Epic Fantasy, two teams, the evil team, a Mexican standoff, the six vs. the ten, the princess shuttling between them, inkeepers and inkeepers daughters, a cozy Doctor Who episode, Star Trek, expands out, sentence by sentence writer, A Connecticut Yankee In King Arthur’s Court, more American exceptionalism, the boss vs. the king, Lest Darkness Fall by L. Sprague de Camp, a failure, falling asleep vs. being hit on the head, falls asleep surrounded by corpses, a satire or a parody, earnest and honorable, participates in whatever’s going on, what makes him awesome, able to ride a horse, good with a sword, bringing democracy to Lutha, bringing democracy to Barsoom, The Pursuit Of The Pankera by Robert A. Heinlein, tourism, exploitation, a very strange sequence in a very strange book, Blackadder Series 3, Rowan Atkinson, American TV Shows One Episode Of A Time is Evan’s other podcast, George III, WWI, descending in status, a descent, Duel And Duality, who gets to be king, ridiculous, upheaval and murder, Alexander the Great’s generals, second sons of farmers, every tenth child goes off to the church, Crusader Kings, crusader monks, clerical work, clerk and clark, the plotting of the book, does the first half work on its own, tracks the guy half-way around the world, randomly, a small continent.

The Mad King And Barney Custer Of Beatrice by Edgar Rice Burroughs - ALL-STORY WEEKLY

The Mad King by Edgar Rice Burroughs

The Mad King by Edgar Rice Burroughs (1926)

The Mad King by Edgar Rice Burroughs - Frank Frazetta 1963

The Mad King (BACK OF THE PAPERBACK)

The Mad King (1915) - Barney Custer Of Beatrice

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The SFFaudio Podcast #583 – READALONG: The King Of Elfland’s Daughter by Lord Dunsany

Podcast

The SFFaudio PodcastThe SFFaudio Podcast #583 – Jesse, Paul Weimer, Scott Danielson, and Will Emmons talk about The King Of Elfland’s Daughter by Lord Dunsany

Talked about on today’s show:
1924, anglo-english? (anglo-irish), a famous fantasy novel, first Dunsany, put off by the preface, scaring readers away, the fields we know, don’t worry, apologizing, tounge in cheek, the narrative voice, “in our day”, a reflection towards the reader, who comes before Dunsany?, fairy tales, the Saga of the Volsungs, before Tolkien, before Lewis, before Robert E. Howard’s Conan, George MacDonald, like urban fantasy of today but not urban, The Encyclopedia Of Fantasy, polder, absorbed into fairy, the tragedy of this book, mixed feelings, a merging, a marriage, aimed poetry, when the witch creates the sword, as much magic as we have, all this magic and all that magic, a column of zeroes, the cleverness of Lord Dunsany, now you’re gone, a repeating motif or theme, The Wonderful Window, from far off Baghdad, the terrible bullshit job he has in the city, the way you get into the fantastic realms is through our world,

“Nobody can tell you about that sword all that there is to be told of it; for those that know of those paths of Space on which its metals once floated, till Earth caught them one by one as she sailed past on her orbit, have little time to waste on such things as magic and so cannot tell you how the sword was made, and those who know whence poetry is, and the need that man has for song, or know any one of the fifty branches of magic, have little time to waste on such things as science, and so cannot tell you whence its ingredients came.”

asteroid metal from outside our world, meteoric iron, its magical yo, stronger than bronze swords, an ongoing theme, clarified and made concrete, we wanna be ruled by a magical lord, be careful what you wish for, a Monkey’s Paw wish, My Talks With Dean Spanley by Lord Dunsany, Dean Spanley (2008), a visiting swami, the transmigration of souls, a welsh spaniel, the joys of sniffing, how he thought of his previous master, the reason Dean Spanley is a priest is his idea of master, such a good boy he was promoted, not a takedown of religion, reincarnation, not typical of his work, what he’s good at, poking ideas, the solid writing, that mythic quality, The Book Of Wonder, Sidney Sime, capturing lightning in a bottle, scenes that are like that, the characters are little dolls, the troll coming to our experiencing the fields we know, watching time, here’s our clever joke, the Pope has a unicorn horn, it all refers back to the preface, Italo Calvino and Michael Chabon, bemusing, a parliament of trolls, infusing the trolls with trollishness, Gentlemen Of The Road, a fantasy without the magic, a road movie, Clifford Simak, The Goblin Reservation, Goblin Market by Christina Rossetti, Shakespeare’s Planet, Over The Fields And Through The Woods, the magic door quality, portal fantasy, the silver wall, a wall of magic, that final rune, the mythic quality, Elric Of Melniboné, The Broken Sword by Poul Anderson, every five lines or so, The Odyssey, rosy fingered dawn, waystations, totems, consciously doing, Don Rodriguez: Chronicles Of Shadow Valley, fields we know, the gentle waves, elfland washing forward like a wave, incredibly subtle, too deep or he didn’t put it in, The Coronation Of Mr. Thomas Shap, The Silver Key, OMG this guy Dunsany!, the half-penny papers, talking about sports, projecting a kingdom on the landscape, camel trains, Hanwell, Bedlam, Arkham Asylum, “go to pretty bed now”, tragic, his name is kinda weird, Shap -> shape -> Lord Shaper, shap -> the husk of silkworm, the home for a transformation, a nice little story, resonances so strong, these stories will stay with you even if you don’t think they will, where does magic come from?, magic as a limited resource, why 3?, Orion, she wants some things, what is he coming across, he encountered a toy he had as a child, snippets of conversation, wistful memories like lost things, this foreign thing, what’s going on in the heads of the people, its made magical and she’s a witch, just three runes, Jesse teaches magic, too young for essay writing, spellcasting, connotation and denotation, the rule of three, threefold magic, it just works, and you can’t question it, the Three Little Bears in Goldilocks, the Three Little Pigs, its not falsifiable, politics, the magical words without any substance [Pete Buttigieg], nonsense poetry, the sounds, that repetition, if I tell you three times its true, he’s a word magician, a spellcaster, we four are already in this world, a bookbuyer, not a reader of The Sketch or The Smart Set, your terrible commute to work, that Ballantine publication, “Adult Fantasy”, all his characters are adults who live in a fantasy world somehow connecting with it, we’re not in the perfect position to appreciate it, Neil Gaiman’s preface to The King Of Elfland’s Daughter by Lord Dunsany, a rich red wine, trust the book, a true magician practitioner, Alan Moore can’t really believe what he’s saying, “I’m a magician”, sometimes the spells don’t work, ingredients/elements/components, you just heard it, there’s this powerful word you can use to solve your problem, training wheels sort of writing, when you uses this magic word, once per essay, the word is: “indeed” says “yes, I agree with myself”, its actually true, if you break the spell, Rumplestiltskin, names have power, true names, the original Lin Carter introduction, Beyond The Fields We Know by Lin Carter, the 18th baron of the ancient line, a 12th century fortress, among hills rich, William the Bastard, steeped in a golden legend, a sensitive poet, a huntsman, one jump ahead of the Nazis, scores of plays, volumes of verse, a complete translation of Horace, with a quill pen, Eaton and Sandhurst, a full exciting and adventurous life, he didn’t have to work, his last speaking tour of America, H.P. Lovecraft, spelling Edgar Allan Poe wrong, YWHA, tall, slender, erect, ruddy apple cheeks, a sloppy baggy suit, deeply moved, linked to greatness, the death of Tennyson, L. Sprague de Camp, William Morris, the single greatest influence, The Dream-Quest Of Unknown Kadath, Robert E. Howard, Clark Ashton Smith, Dunsanian influence, Jack Vance, Jorkens Tales, Arthur C. Clarke, Tales of the Draco Tavern by Larry Niven, Thieves’ World, Lin Carter’s self-boosterism, the Appendix N podcast, he doesn’t mind telling you he’s read all these great books, Dungeons And Dragons, a long neglected masterpieces, May 1924, passages of amazing power, scintillates, into the twilight meadows of fairy, a high land near the thunder, to gather the thunderbolts, from under the cabbage leaves, a stylistic experiment of subtlety, the marriage was doomed from the beginning, welding the two elements, one of the last great masters of English prose, James Branch Cabell, E.R. Eddison, August Derleth, Lin Carter knew his limitations and was happy to be in the room, Neil Gaiman is a magician, tuckerized, the wordspells, Paul Cornell, what’s he going to say to me, he doesn’t know us, The Graveyard Book, now we’re selling it on eBay, a spiritual figure, this aura, the main character (The Sandman) looks a lot like him, he uses his magic for good, that level, test a thesis, the fantasy author who is successful is a magician, Philip K. Dick is a philosopher, an alchemist?, good SF is idea filled, Arthur C. Clarke is the most religious science fiction writer, Olaf Stapledon, Gene Wolfe, Doris Lessing, metaphors are magic, once you start arguing for not facts, whose magic better, can I dispel this with a word, magic is dangerous, making you think things are the way they aren’t, philosophy of science fiction, Hal Clement, a very narrow branch of philosophy, a great connection between mystery fiction and science fiction, Isaac Asimov’s The Naked Sun, philosophy is the magic of science fiction, the magical thinking of SF, to broaden your point, a supplementary, its a better dig, I’m polishing up what you’re doing, distracted (not subtracted), the philosophy of science fiction, playing the role of magic in a fantasy, philosophy in its earliest form is science, lets look at this snail here, nautiluses, mushroom eyes, incredibly ancient and weird, another kind of magic, a way of knowing, the difference between knowledge and story is lore, not subject to the same rules as science, this is the way we do it, analyzing jokes, just keep using it, sometimes jokes don’t have a normal structure and still work, something profoundly philosophical in the way magic is used in this novel, tongue in cheek, making a statement about the world as it is, trying to convert people to his belief system, be enchanted with the world that we have, Dean Spanley as a puppy, enthusiastic, born a famous lord?, a beagle in a previous life, Orion playing a role outside of this book, he mounts a stag on his head, its the Wild Hunt, Herne the Hunter, Deities & Demigods, The Sound Of His Horn by Sarban, veganism, its a new movement, when Will came of age in 2005, vegetarian, the RSCPCA, he’s like a bad man, he’s not a common Irishman, he took a bullet to the head in the Easter Rising, everybody’s full of contradictions, the rich of the late 19th and early 20th, vigorous and interesting people, chessmaster, the Boer War, WWI, go into business, a strange phenomenon, Upstairs, Downstairs except fancy (Downton Abbey), a flourishing in people who have the ability to not worry about cashflow, we have it a lot more and a lot less, that enthusiasm is something we can have, a rising religion, a 1911 issue of The Sketch, The Smart Set, The New Yorker, Winston Churchill in the witness chair, a bank heist, a maxim machine gun, movies made out of it, explaining the plot, anarchists and vegetarians go together, Eric and Evan are also vegetarians, i think about it, something like that, a philosophical position, a following on, 19th century vegetarianism, vegan bodybuilders are a thing, a ground up, so many people who are not religious, the same kind of assurance, I wanna be a good person, what are the rules for me, all these guys at the gym buffing themselves up, when the cannibalism religion comes in the vegans will be the premium beef, so yummy, sustainable, the free range eggs taste better, from Lord Dunsany to cannibalism, out of elfland and into neverneverland, cannibalism from Jesse’s id, the thighbone of a materialist, denying the duality of spirit and matter, an anti-materialist novel, poking and playful, the ancient magazines, Richard Dawkins on eugenics (it could would work), people can go off, new proposal for assigning alignment outside of role playing games, he’s not Chaotic Good,

Historied Historian
Agendaed Historian
Agendaed Historian (Niall Ferguson)

Unlawful Vegan
Unlawful Omnivore
Lawful Cannibalism

Libertarian Buffet-enthusiast
Truly Principled
Polite Chaos-agent

“would you come out please, we need to burn your house down”, read his short stuff, The Highwaymen by Lord Dunsany, definitely against the Man, totally normal, an archbishop, from the ghost’s POV, on attack on authority and an upholding of authority, I’m a rich guy and I can tell these lesser people how to live their lives, sensitive to the needs of the working man, a duality and a sensitivity, the Parliament Of Erl, a misadventure, “the common people get ideas, women are voting, my god!”, the czar’s been overthrown, the result is folly, the alternative is guillotines, the mega-guillotine patent, Guillotine 2020, Bernie is my compromise candidate, how can it continue as it is, until the revolution comes, you can put it down, the British ruling class, hence their still having a monarchy, they’re still lording it up, because of that sensitivity, Churchill is a mass of contradictions, a lust and enthusiasm for life, he didn’t find a war he didn’t like, terribly outrageous, semi-competence and full competence, of you time and of your class, wearing a yellow vest, Kenya, second sons, respecting the lust for life, a more compassionate version of it, people are kind dangerous, a crow with a knife, crow with knife now reformed is father, bears, tigers are beautiful, mercifully killed suddenly by a tiger, the flourishing we see is in tension with the fantasy world, a new kind of flourishing not previously available to the common man, there’s a guy who knows where his towel is, a couple of Star Trek 2 cassette audiobooks, a tidal wave endlessly wave, a wall of magic, the killing of the unicorn, a narwhal horn, the death of innocence, the killing’s cool?, The Book Of The New Sun, Shadow Of The Torturer, hunters are obsessed with the things they prey on, the role of hounds and dogs, part of his vigorous spirit, PUBG is a murder simulator, the temptation to kill is very strong, a kind of fight or flight thing, this could be the end, not even the winning, a 100% real, that vigour that chase that victory, its built into your cells, the most beautiful thing and I’m going to kill it, the great white hunter, you can deny it, and it can be cultivated, hunters everywhere, transforming a desire to kill, that’s why they’re called shots, trophy hunting, undeniable, the hunter, Joe Rogan, you can be an oppressor and an uplifter, will-o-wisps, war, this weird conflict, venerable traveler, star naked, it was a troll that had tricked them, tricksters tricked, fairy tale creatures, a unified thing, so early, The Shadow Of Yesterday, ratkin, an interesting mechanic, the animated Return Of The King, Jesse would become a beaglekin, sniffing at gates and bases of trees and jumping over pots, Jesse really enjoyed the troll.

Ballantine - The King Of Elfland's Daughter by Lord Dunsany

BB - The King Of Elfland's Daughter by Lord Dunsany

Posted by Jesse Willis

The SFFaudio Podcast #565 – READALONG: Last Days Of Thronas by Stuart J. Byrne

Podcast

The SFFaudio PodcastThe SFFaudio Podcast #525 – Jesse and Paul Weimer talk about Last Days Of Thronas by Stuart J. Byrne

Talked about on today’s show:
and today we’re reading…, John Bloodstone, an old science fiction novel, why wouldn’t I read this book?, public domain, never heard of this guy, Science Stories, February 1954, house names or pseudonyms, tiers of science fiction magazines, armchair fiction, digging into the issue, the cover has nothing to do with the contents of the story, a brilliant 45,000 word novel, a singular spaceship, J. Allen St. John, Edgar Rice Burroughs, Tarzan, Warlord Of Mars, The Moon Maid, a Burroughsian planetary romance, splash page, the creature, his former lover, a precursor, L. Sprague de Camp’s Viagens Interplanetarias, against the rules, find each other attractive, tentacles out of eyebrows, an ancient spaceship, the subjugated people have invented gunpowder, backgrounded to Garthanas’ story, what Paul would be thinking about Jesse would be thinking about the worldbuilding, how little this book has been published, it does was it says on the tin, a man off his world (or not our world), the ending, a solar system with two and a half inhabitable planets, Thronas is the fifth world, Carson of Venus, Hamardeen, the math and the names, a panspermia story, dinosaur time, Dalathasheen, Haven, Adamas, a tropical haven, a vast natural garden which they named…, Atlantis,

Their dreams of old we, too, have known,
But we are flesh and they are
stone,
And Yesterday is dust…

just some rando, a weird way to start a story, Tolkien, narrator Tim Harper, preeeety good job, so good, very specific vocab, names of days, all of the logic, names of ranks, layer up this world, as logical and rational as possible, lovely detail, the amphitheater, very vivid, very colourful, a real sense of embodiment, the interests of the author, elf names, etymological construction to the names of things, the measuring system, worldbuilding and making a whole universe (or solar system) for a FIVE HOUR BOOK, and to make the story work as well, the same trick over and over: a secret identity, he’s teaching us, you like Twelfth Night, you like Shakespeare, he’s turning evil, what if I’ve been rooting for a monster this whole time, that’s good writing, the AI of the ship, the metal god, a very early AI, from such an oblique angle, The Great C by Philip K. Dick, he Kirks the computer, I love that idea, the computer doesn’t say, if Kirking is a verb, apparently Gene Roddenberry was a fan, “I’d stand in a line in the rain for one of Stu Byrne’s stories”, back when Paul was young and strong, Thundarr The Barbarian Garth Ennis, one of the many many rip-off’s if Conan, make the show to sell the toys, unpublished Tarzan novel, fan fiction, the Pellucidars, the Barsoom books, male romancesque, lost to time, when the book is THIS interesting, the archaeology of this sort of thing, born in 1911, Jam Packed with Burroughs, more of the same, He-Man, She-Ra, Red Sonja (from the comics), filed-off serial numbers, friendship works differently in Burroughs-world, honor-based friendship, more sex and drinking, more carousing, no animal friend, no Woola, The Green Odyssey, a loving-parody-comedy vs. straight-up, Michael Moorcock, Glory Road by Robert A. Heinlein, hard to escape the orbit of Burroughs, S.M. Stirling, Tantor Media, The Sky People, In The Courts Of The Crimson Kings, he goes wide, characterizing the responses to Burroughs, dinosaurs on Mars, Leigh Brackett, aliens, A World Of Difference by Harry Turtledove, a collapsed empire, the golden ship is a great piece, with that ending he’s cutting off all the sequels, what it turns this book into is a science fiction book of the mainstream type, acceleration, artificial gravity, a force of nature like the tides, the worship of many many gods, how much work he put into this, not a work of slapdashery, Goodreads reviews, the used bookstores podcast, Goodreads is owned by Amazon, many moral hazards in the universe, AbeBooks is owned by Amazon, Byrne is from St. Paul,

It has all the hallmarks of a hastily-written product plus one whose creator has a very specific beginning and endpoint in mind and is working to bridge the two. Byrne occasionally has to paste in the gaps with backstory or offstage events–clearly he was not going to go back and revise–and this leaves the impression that more interesting things are happening to more interesting people while Garthanas is standing around waiting or being talked to.

The story is also strangely unspecific about the context. It’s implied that the oppressed Harmarians are some kind of ethnic minority who are slowly being deported to planet Hamardeen (Mars) because the Thronasians would prefer to be served by the unpredictable and violent nonhuman polar inhabitants, but nobody says this and it is not explained clearly. The half-explanations conspire to baffle and not tantalize with unseen depths.

“Space barbarians” is arrived at uniquely, with a robotic Golden Ship left behind by an earlier civilization. It is a tragedy that this is the only remnant of super-science and one wonders what more Byrne could have added to liven up this story.

The final moments, as it starts to wrap up, do achieve power. Byrne finally has a specific vision with a specific end goal and Garanthas is in place to witness it all and to act appropriately. But the overall impression is less “tale of multigenerational tragedy” than “muddled mess”.

hanging out with a Roman slave who knows how the Roman Empire works, a case of reviewism, a disease that effects many reviewers, space barbarians, a trope, maybe it needed more pondering, a lot of battle scenes, before we talk about the art, action packed, almost the script for Buck Rogers, so many court scenes, sneaking around inside of a space ship, a Star Wars (1977) level of action, kissing, intrigue, how you are when you come to something, a serious problem when they do reviews a lot, IMDB or Rotten Tomatoes, he’s writing to his own conclusion, award winning is a bad word in Jesse’s mind, The Aquiliad: Aquila In The New World by S.P. Somtow, you need to know what the author is doing, answers to What If, the artist knew truth, the only person better at sculpting than me is my master, a very small pair of worlds, another connection to Star Wars, hello Jupiter, reading into it, he wanted to have philosophy in it without getting into it, a thinker king like King Kull, appreciating the art, about that meditation, a John Carter who is appreciating the martian sculptures, normally that’s us when reading the books, the statue at the end, it’s in that opening song, a future echo, an echo of the past, Battlestar Galactica, page 13, we are flesh and they are stone, playing with, the word “Truth”, Ozymandias by Percy Shelley, Ozymandias by Horace Smith, On A Stupendous Leg Of Granite…, hubris is a great problem, uh huh and yup and we’re going to be the same way, more political, Lovecraftian vs. science fictional, that projection, Beyond Thirty by Edgar Rice Burroughs, Robert Charles Wilson’s Darwinia, the journals and a report about what’s going on in North America, Planet Of The Apes, fast paced, Jack McDevitt’s Eternity Road, so many great books that are just hidden away, ratings are a part of the problem of reviewism, star ratings, clouding judgement, it straight jackets you, the pain management chart, hangnail 1, gaping flesh wound from sword stab 8, a standard of one person, the way Luke Burrage justifies his rating system, this is not a classic like a The House On The Borderland, The Time Machine, more worldbuilding than The Green odyssey, Tolkien vs. Narnia, portal fantasy vs. secondary world, six hours well spent, thank you to Tim Harper.

Last Days Of Thronas by S.J. Byrne - illustration by J. Allen St. John

Last Days Of Thronas by S.J. Byrne - illustration by J. Allen St. John

Last Days Of Thronas by S.J. Byrne - illustration by J. Allen St. John

Last Days Of Thronas by S.J. Byrne - illustration by J. Allen St. John

Posted by Jesse Willis